Nitrogen filled tyres at GBM tyres.

[thinkinggrenades]

its more a question of Temprature and pressure stability, nitrogen is a much more stable medium to fill a tyre with as it doesnt expand as much as oxygen when heated, so your tyre pressures stay at the right pressure for longer when the tyre heats up. - brilliant if your racing. its also a little lighter than air, and it doesnt absorb water (tiny amounts anyway) on a road car i cant see it making a whole load of difference.

[Pugguy]

Nitrogen is no more pressure stable than air, both are gasses that respond the same to temperature change. Air is barly more dense than nitrogen @ 1.292 kg/m3. The density of nitrogen is 1.251 kg/m3 - just .042kg/m3 more dense! ....basically the same.

[gbmtyres]

if its a gimmik mate why has it been in a motorsport for years any questions call us or call the guy at tyrebay direct and talk to the man who designed this system which i might add is the same as the f1 system as he will answer any questions you have, failing that COME AND TRY IT FOR YOUR SELVES!!! REFILLS ARE FREE TO ANY EXISTING GBM CUSTOMERS ANYHOW !!! SO WHERES THE GIMMICK?? We put it in the shanti GBM van and its made the world of difference not to mention countless FAST cars, motor factor delivery vans, and normal cars and our own motorsevrybody who has had this notices a considerable inprovement in handling, can all these people be wrong ? somehow i dont think so also a great percentage of new vehicles arrive with nitrogen filled tyres . no offence but if you aint tried it yourself how can you comment ? come down il give you a free trial were tryin to offer a better service not use this as a money maker all the best GBM

[Dooahhdoo]

I was going to ask if its OK to put into bike tyres. Googled it and started reading http://www.fireblades.org/forums/general-discussion/66761-nitrogen-bike-tires.html. Got bored half way down page 1 when my brain started melting

[starskyknight]

I'll take a punt on some in the A-Team van when the new tyres arrive John, gotta be worth a try for a few quid! If it makes 5% difference, its worth it for me. Breaking, handling, tyre wear, very important to me to squeek out every bit, espescially in a big ol' van!

[Pugguy]

if its a gimmik mate why has it been in a motorsport for years any questions call us or call the guy at tyrebay direct and talk to the man who designed this system which i might add is the same as the f1 system as he will answer any questions you have, failing that COME AND TRY IT FOR YOUR SELVES!!! REFILLS ARE FREE TO ANY EXISTING GBM CUSTOMERS ANYHOW !!! SO WHERES THE GIMMICK?? We put it in the shanti GBM van and its made the world of difference not to mention countless FAST cars, motor factor delivery vans, and normal cars and our own motorsevrybody who has had this notices a considerable inprovement in handling, can all these people be wrong ? somehow i dont think so also a great percentage of new vehicles arrive with nitrogen filled tyres . no offence but if you aint tried it yourself how can you comment ? come down il give you a free trial were tryin to offer a better service not use this as a money maker all the best GBM

I still have been unable to find one reputable report that they are of any benefit to standard road users (the best I found was " If it's free, go ahead and use it. If you have to pay for it, save your money" on Autoblog http://www.autoblog.com/2006/05/03/high ... ate-again/ ) Surly if it was beneficial why dont even the AA recomend it?

How do you remove 'all' of the 'air' before filling with nitrogen to ensure the tire is filled with pure nitrogen & no air remains?
I dont question its use in F1 & planes + specialist applications etc but thats a different world to road cars where tires never get as hot as an F1 car to make much difference (10 degrees = 1 psi)

Handling: nitrogen responds to heat exaclty the same as air! so pressure changes are the same.

There are lots of mods that are done to rally & race vehicles that are just irrelevant to standard road cars.

no offence but if you aint tried it yourself how can you comment ?

One does not need to try something to debate its use if there have been expert consumer reports advising against it.

[Pugguy]

We put it in the shanti GBM van and its made the world of difference not to mention countless FAST cars, motor factor delivery vans, and normal cars and our own motorsevrybody who has had this notices a considerable inprovement in handling, can all these people be wrong ?

In answer to your question, yes -either misguided (the placebo effect) or more likley their tires were incorectly inflated before the change.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/09/autom ... 9MOTO.html
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars ... trogen.htm
http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/sa ... rogen.html
http://www.bankrate.com/brm/news/car-ad ... gen_a1.asp
http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... efficiency
+ plenty more...

Can all these 'experts' be wrong?

[JayJay]

I'm afraid I agree with Puggy. Yep it's used in motorsport (and plane tyres!) but the reasoning is completely different. In planes it means the oxygen in the tyres doesn't freeze, in motorsport it's used "because it allows [motorsport teams] to more accurately predict tire pressure fluctuation. Nitrogen fluctuates with temperature change, but it does so less than when water vapor is present" (take from the Get Nitrogen site). This has NO BEARING on road users Do you have an incredibly fine tuned suspension set up? Do you tweak it regularly? Or do you actually drive on varying road surfaces that would make these minor tweaks useless? It's just another gimmick-y reason to get people to buy it, another "if its used in motorsport it means it's a must have for road users". To be honest you'd get more improvement from buying better tyres and just checking the pressure once a week (when you fill up perhaps? Or check the oil?).

It won't however offer ANY performance increase in a road car, it's not some magic molecule. The only reasoning FOR it I've seen is that you have to pump the tyres up less regularly.....

Either way, a car is a car, and it needs maintenance. I can't justify spending money on something that will have no effect on the cars handling, just to reduce having to check the tyre pressure, which you WILL have to do anyway as most of the pressure is lost through the valve and the tyre/alloy seal. It just means you have to take it to the garage to get it pumped up insted of being able to do it yourself.

So you will have to check the tyres regularly anyway

We put it in the shanti GBM van and its made the world of difference not to mention countless FAST cars, motor factor delivery vans, and normal cars and our own motorsevrybody who has had this notices a considerable inprovement in handling, can all these people be wrong ?

In answer to your question, yes -either misguided (the placebo effect) or more likley their tires were incorectly inflated before the change.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/09/autom ... 9MOTO.html
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars ... trogen.htm
http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/sa ... rogen.html
http://www.bankrate.com/brm/news/car-ad ... gen_a1.asp
http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... efficiency
+ plenty more...

Can all these 'experts' be wrong?

[iomgto]

How can you comment when you havent used them? I was very like minded like yourself. thought its worth a try and when pushing hard and usually experience alot of slop in the tyres i found that i lost most of this and car seems to hold itself together more through twisty cornering..... Its £3 a tyre or something i use triple that amount having a blast round the tt course.... Plus you can pop in and get them to check refill when every... In doing so you get a second pair of eyes over your car checking its in safe working order........ which is nice. they might spot something you might of missed or not realised... that in itself if a safety aspect....

[Pugguy]

How can you comment when you havent used them? I was very like minded like yourself. thought its worth a try and when pushing hard and usually experience alot of slop in the tyres i found that i lost most of this and car seems to hold itself together more through twisty cornering..... Its £3 a tyre or something i use triple that amount having a blast round the tt course.... Plus you can pop in and get them to check refill when every... In doing so you get a second pair of eyes over your car checking its in safe working order........ which is nice. they might spot something you might of missed or not realised... that in itself if a safety aspect....

Most garages offer free saftey checks anyway, Im not debating the service of GBM who have got excellent reviews- just if nitrogen in car tires is worth it or not....
Even so, you would only go back if you noticed your tires were looking low, so how far are you having to drive with under inflated tires?

I really dont see how nitrogen in your tires makes it 'hold itself together more'? The laws of physics just dont support your claim, I doubt your tires will get warm enough over the mountain to make any temperature/pressure change of any moisture that 'may' be in the air of the tires noticable (even if it did the pressure increase would make the tires firmer anyway).

If it really did make the car handle 'so' much better then why at rally service areas dont all the teams have a can of nitrogen?... rally teams are at the forefront of technology where every split second counts- have they missed this magic gas?
Not even the WRC use nitrogen in tires.

Formula 1 is very different where tires get so hot a pressure increase could mean a blow out.

Go buy a £5 foot pump, carry it in the car & spend the other £7 on fuel